RZA, a mastermind, a visionary, and a founding member of the legendary Hip-Hop group Wu-Tang Clan, stopped by ‘The Jason Lee Show‘ to talk his new film, ‘One Spoon of Chocolate,’ his legendary career in music and entertainment, Ol’ Dirty Bastard (ODB), plus more.
From building Wu-Tang Clan from the ground up to redefining creativity across music, film, and culture, RZA and host Jason Lee bounce between legacy and evolution in an effortless way. In one conversation, they’re breaking down the formula behind 36 Chambers and the discipline it took to build a brotherhood. In the next, they’re diving into storytelling, filmmaking, and what it really means to create with intention.
During this interview, RZA, born Robert Fitzgerald Diggs, also reflects on second chances, sobriety, and the mindset shift that changed the course of his life. He gets real about the balance between ego and growth, the responsibility artists carry, and why purpose not fame drives everything he creates today. From Hip-Hop’s past to its future, this living legend makes it clear he’s still building, still learning, and still pushing the culture forward.
RELATED: Wu-Tang Clan’s RZA Speaks On Lil Duval’s Hip Hop Hot-Takes
RZA Talks Wu-Tang Clan And Other Staten Island Greats, Being A ‘GED Baby,’ And Attempted Murder Acquittal
As the interview begins, RZA talks the legend of 36 Chambers, the intentional decisions he made when building Wu-Tang, and speaks on the artists from State Island that came before them. He highlights Staten Island’s own: Force MCs, who eventually became the Force MDs; The UMCs; Shyheim “The Rugged Child”; and Milk D; K-Rock (MC Lyte‘s DJ).
He also mentions Kid (of Kid ‘n Play) lived on Staten Island during high school. However, RZA affirms that the group to put Staten Island, aka Shaolin, on the map was Wu-Tang. He also gives a general shout out to the founding members of Hip-Hop: The Cold Crush Brothers, Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five, Busy Bee.
RZA talks his philosophy on creating Wu-Tang. He shares that when he and his co-founding members first started out, taking their slang, swag, and flavor of Hip-Hop to the mainstream was intentional. RZA also talks about meeting and learning from Hip-Hop’s heroes as Prince Rakeem, before he built Wu-Tang. He said he and his crew strived to be greater than the greats.
After RZA and Lee applaud themselves for becoming successful as “GED babies,” they change gears to recall RZA’s attempted murder acquittal. The rapper admitted he was going the wrong, claiming he “zig-zagged,” highlighting the meaning behind his stage name. He recalled being involved ins street crime and “trying to be an entrepreneur with the wrong product, and it led to trouble after trouble.”
RELATED: Rihanna And ASAP Rocky’s Son Named After Wu-Tang Clan Member: RZA Athelston Mayers
RZA Talks Wu-Tang Clan’s Aggression And Strength In Hip-Hop, Method Man And Mary J. Blige’s Iconic Hip-Hop & R&B Crossover
He said that at 21/22 years old, he faced a jury and a judge, who ultimately acquitted him on attempted murder charges. He recalled his mother’s face of disappointment and her advising him to do better with his second chance at life. RZA said he listened and “zig-zagged-zigged, went back to the right direction.” He said, “I sobered up and starting making beats. A lot of those beats became 36 Chambers. I became The RZA.”
Lee continued to ask RZA about his group’s “aggression, loud attitudes, loud fashion, loud cohesion, and loud songs,” like on their hits “C.R.E.A.M.” and “Wu-Tang Clan Ain’t Nuthing Ta F’ Wit.” The rapper said he didn’t know if people hated them, “because it wasn’t shown” to them. However, he believed “there was a lot of fear from others.” He added, “But I think we were appreciated by a lot of our peers because Hip-Hop has that element. The aggression and the strength was part of it.”
As the interview, continues, RZA talks about the commercialization of Hip-Hop in modern day. He also recalls Method Man and Mary J. Blige‘s classic collaboration, “I’ll Be There For You / You’re All I Need To Get By.” The hit was one-of-a-kind and transformative. The track and the music video helped usher in the mix between Hip-Hop and R&B. RZA didn’t confirm if it was the first time Hip-Hop and R&B collaborated, but said it was the first time it was given a Grammy Award (1995).
RELATED: RZA Speaks On Rihanna And A$AP Rocky Naming Their Baby Boy After Him: It’s A Great Honor’
RZA Taps Quentin Tarantino, Shameik Moore, Blair Underwood, Paris Jackson, RJ Cyler For New Film ‘One Spoon Of Chocolate’
Jason Lee then mentions Quentin Tarantino and how RZA came to work on ‘Kill Bill.’ The legend served as the primary composer and orchestrator for ‘Kill Bill: Volume 1 (2003).’ RZA recalls the story of how he and Tarantino first connected. He reveals how they built a friendship over their shared love of watching, writing, directing, and producing movies. Since ‘Kill Bill,’ RZA and Tarantino have reunited for their new film, ‘One Spoon Of Chocolate.’
The visionary Wu-Tang Clan member speaks on writing, directing, and producing his new action-thriller, releasing in theaters on May 1. The film, presented by Quentin Tarantino, stars Shameik Moore. He is best known for his role in the film ‘Dope‘ and being the voice of “Miles Morales” in the ‘Spider-Verse‘ films. Co-starring is Blair Underwood, Paris Jackson and RJ Cyler.
The summary for the latest project from the visionary leader of the Wu-Tang Clan reads:
“ONE SPOON OF CHOCOLATE follows ‘Unique,’ a veteran and ex-convict seeking a fresh start in a small town. After getting into an altercation with a gang of locals, he starts to suspect they may have something to do with the disappearance of young men in the area — including his cousin.
As he digs for the truth, he finds himself the target of not only the gang, but the local sheriff’s office, whose involvement in the disappearances may be even more sinister. Instead of waiting for his turn to be picked off, Unique and those closest to him decide to fight back in this sharply satirical and stylish action thriller.”
RZA also reflects on his late cousin and Wu-Tang Clan groupmate, Ol’ Dirty Bastard, born Russell Tyrone Jones. He recalls growing up together, breaking day, watching movies, etc. He admits, “Losing ODB, physically, you don’t recover from that. But, spiritually and mentally, he’s always here.” RZA also talks about his older cousin, GZA, born Gary Eldridge Grice, He called him “the light” for them. He also reveals that he included ODB’s son Young Dirty Bastard (YDB), born Barsun Unique Jones, in the film and even one of ODB’s songs.
RZA Talks Rap Beefs Between Drake & Kendrick Lamar, 2Pac & Notorious B.I.G.; And Rihanna & A$AP Rocky Naming First Son After Him
The Wu-Tang founder later talks about beefs in Rap/Hip-Hop and whether or not it’s needed.
“I think competition—Hip-Hop is a sport. It’s a sport form of songwriting. It’s a sport form of music. I think competition is always, always welcomed. ‘Needed’ is a big word. Do we need it? No, we don’t need nothing. But, it is a sport. The battle of the bands go back to The Temptations and The Four Tops, and that wasn’t even Hip-Hop. So, if it’s gonna build the muscles, and make the artists better, and make the genre better, then let’s welcome it. If it’s gonna tear the genre down, nah, let’s get rid of it.”
When asked if he believes the Drake and Kendrick Lamar Rap beef did anything good for the genre, he said:
“I think it started off good. But, I think that it ended up gray. And what I mean by gray is—this is going back to what JAY-Z said—We don’t know [Drake and Kendrick] individually. A lot of us haven’t met them, a lot of us, or most people. So, what’s real about the lyric and what’s fake about the lyric is gray. But, if you believe what Kendrick is saying, then wow, that sh*t is deep on Drake. Or if you believe what Drake is saying, that sh*t is deep on Kendrick. And that’s where it gets ugly. That’s where it gets to the point, where it’s like, that’s the Pac and Biggie of it all.”
RELATED: Oliver ‘Power’ Grant, Founding Member Of Wu-Tang Clan & Founder Of Wu Wear, Dies At 52
Towards the end of the interview, RZA talks selling his catalog, not getting a Grammy, and Wu-Tang Clan being inducted into the 2026 Rock & Roll Hall of Fame and going on tour with, ‘Wu-Tang Forever: The Final Chamber.’ He also talks about Rihanna and A$AP Rocky naming their first son after him, RZA Athelston Mayers.
He said, “I took that as an honor. I took that as an honor of respect and blessing.” He also gives Rocky his flowers and recalls the Harlem rapper telling him he’d be just like him with his crew A$AP Mob. Lee then FaceTimes Rocky to allow the two musicians to exchange their flowers.
By the end of the interview, RZA plays a game of “Name Drop.” During the segment, he speaks on: Nas; Damon Dash (Dame Dash); ODB (who was posing with Dame Dash and Mariah Carey), Kanye West, Oliver “Power” Grant.
#Socialites, be sure to check out the full interview below, then leave us your thoughts in a comment after!
